Welcome to the Episode!
Kumaar Bagrodia, a pioneer in neurotechnology and brain training, joins us to discuss actionable brain hacks for focus, productivity, and success. This episode delves into the subconscious mind, brain mapping, and cutting-edge techniques to optimize mental and emotional health.

Let's enjoy the transcript.

Ryan:You worked with a lot of high end achievers. What are some of the things that you'd like to share with our listeners?

Bargodia: You know, the first part people need to understand is that the brain and the mind are separate. The brain is the physical organ. The mind is just a manifestation. Sukumar, why do you focus on the subconscious?

Our subconscious is about three lakh times more powerful than our conscious mind. Between one to five percent of who you are is your consciousness. Everything else, 95 to 99 percent is just a Have you worked with any smokers on this? Tell me any chain smoker you know who's illiterate. Are they educated?

Most of them are very successful lawyers, doctors, engineers, businessmen, billionaires. Billionaires, right? Why are they not illiterate? They are rational individuals, right? If you see a cigarette box, it has ghastly images of cancer, etc. Why were the images given there? To then jar the subconscious that, oh my god, what is this?

There is no addiction. Which is a problem of the conscious mind. Addiction is a

Ryan:So, you've been called India's Brain Enhancer.

Bargodia:What are some of the things that you'd like to share with our listeners? The WHO came up with a study in 2017 that one in five people in India at the show. So

Ryan:how do we change it?

Bargodia:Your entire eating habits are part of a behavioral process. It starts, like I said, before you eat.

So rather than, what should I eat? The question then is Why am I?

Ryan:I'm thrilled to bring to you a truly eye opening episode with India's leading neuroscientist Kumar Bagrodia, the brilliant mind behind NeuroLeap.

Kumar is doing groundbreaking work in brain science using advanced non invasive neurotechnology to help people from high achievers to students and homemakers upgrade their subconscious brain with transformational benefits. Whether you're leading a team. or pushing your limits as an athlete. This episode is a must watch.

You learn how brain mapping can transform performance. Explore how the energy we fuel our brain with impacts. everything we do and unpack the fascinated role of the subconscious mind. And if you're curious about the future of brain tech, we even touch on innovations that could change how we think, perform and including advancements along the lines of Elon Musk's Eurolink.

Whether you're aiming to boost performance, break bad habits, get better sleep. Self discipline, attention, simply learn more about the amazing power of your brain. You won't want to miss this. But before I let your brain take over, please like, share or subscribe to my podcast. My brain is requesting your brain.

And you know what? Your brain is going to thank me in the future. But without further ado, let's get cracking on this amazing

Ryan (2): insights of the brain.

Ryan:So you've been called India's brain enhancer. Okay. What are some of the things that you'd like to share with our listeners before we dive deep into the brain?

Bargodia:You know, that's, that's a moniker which several media outfits have used and I'm grateful for it. You know, the first part people need to understand is that the brain and the mind are separate.

And we often use both these terms interchangeably, which is incorrect. The brain is the physical organ. The mind is just a manifestation. You know, it's not tangible. You can't, you can't weigh it, you know, see it, touch it. And you do need to then take care of the physical organ, the brain, just as you take care of your gut, your heart, your lungs, the rest of your body, your muscles, skin.

Why not? Look after your brain and there are certain things you can do to look after your brain in your day to day life and Once in a while come to people like us to to help you further so basically

Ryan:you're saying there's the physical part of the brain and then there is the Energy part of the brain which is the thinking or the mind is that is that how these two worlds kind of can be looked At just for the lay person like me.

Well, I

Bargodia:wouldn't say energy separate from the physical part, right? So the brain functions on energy, our entire body, our nervous system generates and runs on bioelectrical energy.

Ryan:So I'm thinking in my head, it's like, AI right now, but the AI still needs a chip. So the brain is the chip, right? And the AI is the intelligence.

Bargodia:Well, I would just simplify it. You're right. I would just simplify it further and say hardware and software. So the brain is the hardware. The mind, in a way, is a software. It's an oversimplification, but yes, for the layperson, that should suffice.

Ryan:You see, as a nutritionist, I'm always looking at protein, carbs, fats, vitamins, minerals, water, air, and all of these things can enhance human performance.

And how do people win medals and stuff like that? So with you, you worked with a lot of high end achievers, and you're bringing in technology that can help them get to the next level. What is this tech? What are the terms that are used? And how are they able to map whatever functions in the brain that are there and how does it impact their performance?

Bargodia:I would love to answer that question. Can I ask you one question before that? As a nutritionist, I'm sure you see thousands of clients, high performers, people from all walks of life. What is the number one complaint that That people, even if they are told, given the best nutrition chart plan, not everyone can follow it properly.

Ryan:I think the behavior or the desire or, or whatever, the, the, the, the willpower to, to, to do that. The self discipline.

Bargodia:Yeah. So why is all of that happening? So why is that the human brain or the human mind or the psyche, even though it knows what's good for it, what's right for it, they've spent a ton of money coming to you a lot of time and effort helping you analyze their lifestyle, their nutritional demands and needs, and then create a plan.

Why aren't they following it through? They know it's good for them because the human brain and mind is not necessarily only operating on rationality.

Okay.

Bargodia:And eating disorders are now one of the largest. disorders in the world. Think of it. How many of us eat when we are anxious stress eating? How many of us eat extra when we are very happy and in a celebratory mood?

Ryan:I've had a long day. I go back home. I know I'm a nutritionist, but you know what? I just would love to see my son's lays chips packet and take two pieces of that when I know I shouldn't be doing that. We have been

Bargodia:conditioned. to believe that we have earned bad food.

Ryan:We have been conditioned to believe that we have earned it.

That's an amazing line.

Bargodia:Right? Why? Like you said, it's a long day. I've behaved myself throughout the day. I've seen 20, 30, 40 clients, whatever it is. Now I'm going to go home and I've earned that junk, whatever it is.

I'm not in a good mood. Food's easily available. You know, I can have the best or the worst food. Ordered, delivered to me within 30 minutes and because of my bad mood, I end up doing that or I end up eating too fast because I'm hyper, I'm restless, I'm not chewing properly, so on and so forth. So food is one of the manifestations of how your brain is functioning before you have consumed it.

Think of it. When was the last time you had a client who said, you know what? You can give me whatever diet you, I will follow it 100 percent to the T. No cheat days, you know, no junk meals, nothing. Don't even incorporate any leniency. Very rare.

Maybe some of the high performing sports stars, etc. But the average person just can't do that. So food and the brain, food and the subconscious brain, are very closely interlinked. And a lot of your issues Start from there. So one of the reasons we bring in technology is that now it's difficult. To understand one's subconscious patterns simply by engaging in some sort of a psychometric test alone.

So you need technology to understand the subconscious brainwaves directly.

Ryan:So you're saying the brain is in one plane and there is technology that can analyze all of this. Of course. Why do you think only super achievers and high performance people will subscribe to this technology initially?

Bargodia:So, so we've been commercial for over seven years now, and we've had thousands of clients from all across the country and even several from across the world.

I don't think it's just about super achievers, but by definition, a person who is on a growth trajectory realizes that the brain is the final frontier, that they've reached where they are because of certain things they've done right. And how can they use this platform now to leapfrog even further?

That's one.

Bargodia:And the second thing I must clarify, it's not that we are only working with celebrities, you know, we work with homemakers, students, people from all walks of life. The distinguishing factor is that each one of them understands the importance of working on their brain.

Ryan:Okay. So when we talk about the brain, there's energy involved.

What's the major role of energy? in maintaining the optimal functioning of the brain. So I focus on the subconscious

Bargodia:brain, right? Okay.

Ryan:So are there different types of

Bargodia:brains? I'm just, so let me add there, you know, you're sitting in a particular way. I'm sitting in a particular way. We have certain mannerisms.

On how we move, think, react, respond, all of those are part of our subconscious. It's habits, patterns, stereotypes biases, and hence your mindset. Those are the ones that we are concerned with. It's the subconscious brainwave patterns that we are concerned with, right? Not what you're thinking currently.

So our technology cannot read your mind, it cannot read your memories, it can't access, you know, any imagery in the sense of saying, Oh, I did this five years ago. And I will read that. No, that's not what we do. What we're concerned with is how is your anxiety network functioning? How is your mood network functioning?

And before I get into the energy side of brain function, it's important to understand how the brainwave patterns emerge and how the brain functions. So Our subconscious is about three lakh times more powerful than our conscious mind, 300, 000 times. Wow.

Ryan:That's why they keep saying, go into your subconscious and manifest from there.

So it's three lakh times more powerful.

Bargodia:So about 1 percent to a maximum of 5%, between 1 to 5 percent of who you are, is your consciousness. Everything else, 95 to 99%. It's just a bunch of subconscious pattern.

The human brain is bombarded with 11 Mbps of data every second. 11 megabits per second. The conscious mind is only able to process 50 bits. 50 bits, not 50 Mbps. 11 Mbps is what you're being hit with. 50 bits is what you're consciously processing. Where's all the other stuff being processed in the subconscious?

Since you work with a lot of people in. Competitive sports. Let's take, let's take cricket as an example. What is a good speed of a fast bowler? Let's say 140,

Ryan:143 kilometers. Yeah. So let's say

Bargodia:140 kilometers per hour. It's just a fraction of a second between the ball. Leaving the bowler's hand and making contact with the bat.

Where is the time the batsman has to start reacting and responding with complete consciousness on his stance, his footwork, his grip. How is he going to turn the bat? Where is he going to flick it? It's impossible. These are all millisecond decisions. And those decisions are already taken. And that's why the batsman practices for 6 to 8 to 10 hours a day.

So that in the match, all he's thinking about is like, okay, what's the fielder placement like what is the sort of run rate he has to go after to be able to judge his risk appetite on that shot? That's about it. Everything else is on autopilot. So we call it autopilot. We call it muscle memory. It's just.

The subconscious pattern, which you have trained for hours, months, years, and it's become a pattern. So you see a fastball coming in a certain fashion and you will hit it in a particular way.

Ryan:So this is maybe in a sports person. So we are mapping the, the brainwave patterns. And how do we understand that there are?

Issues. Maybe not even with a cricketer. You said even homemakers come to you, right? So I'm just assuming, yeah, the software is there, the hardware is there, and then there's a software, and then you're reading off the software. So If there are inherent issues, then how does, how do we understand these brain patterns and how do we come about with resolution?

Sure.

Bargodia:So, so first off, it's a very simple non invasive process. You're at one of our centers, you're seated on a chair exactly like this. We put in a bunch of sensors all over your head.

Ryan:Why over the head? Because the brain is there.

Bargodia:Yes. Okay. So we want to get in brainwave data from as close as possible.

So nothing goes inside your brain, there is no magnetic wave going in, no electromagnetic field, nothing goes inside.

Ryan:But you are able to read a brainwave? Yeah.

Bargodia:So we are just able to read the electrical energy. Which is in the brain and the software makes brain wave patterns out of it. Pretty much as you would use with a ECG for your heart.

Now you're doing it for your brain. I must clarify with that we map the whole brain. You know, we, we get a lot of queries nowadays saying, Oh, you know, there are do it yourself kits available. There are, you know, weird things available where you can supposedly map your brain yourself, like become your own you know, doctor or therapist or whatever.

It's it's. too risky to try and do that. Nevertheless, so we are mapping the entire brain. We are trying to get data calculate data right down from your cerebellum. So cerebellum is your little brain, as they call it. It's really a small part, but it has 80 percent of your neurons. Yeah. 80 percent of your neurons is in your cerebellum.

And for decades, it was believed that the cerebellum had limited role to play, but now there is enough evidence. That your cerebellum is actually responsible for a lot of your decision making, moods, behavior food control, appetite control rather. The cerebellum has a huge role to play. In India, currently, nobody has been able to effectively understand and help enhance the function of the cerebellum besides us.

Okay.

Bargodia:So after sitting in that chair for 30 minutes, we read your brainwaves in about 8 or 10 hours. We will generate a 25 page report filled with data charts and graphs on how each of your brainwave patterns is functioning related to your attention, memory, mood. Addiction, obsession, your decision making, your self discipline, your willpower social anxiety, neuropsychological IQ scores, without actually doing an IQ test.

We can also even look at learning disabilities, ADHD, and so forth. Once this is done, we have a consultation with the client. I must add, nowhere in this process have we asked the client to disclose any disorders. or any symptoms yet.

Ryan:So it's almost like a blood test of the brain. Like I get a blood test and like, Oh, okay.

You know, I see somebody's blood test, but I'm like, I think you're drinking a little bit too much. So this is like without any questionnaire. Yeah.

Bargodia:Zero. It is a hundred percent on your objective brainwave data. It is not based on your mood. on that day, on that instant, because we are not just putting in a bunch of sensors and, and tracking whether you are stressed or whether you are happy.

We're trying to understand what are those patterns and how do they behave on a general basis.

Ryan:So when they have studied the brain, And you said 80 percent of the cerebellum does a lot of the thinking. How do they come up with all of this? Is there that there was statistical research on a segment of people and they've said, okay, this part of the brain or this signature pattern is indicated of memory or anxiety?

Bargodia:Absolutely. So, it's called the connectome theory. So it is not like one part of the brain has only one function.

silent:Mm hmm.

Bargodia:And neither is it true. that one function resides only in that part. Got it. For example, let's say anxiety. There are certain parts which are hubs, but they need to be connected. So we study not just how those hubs are working.

But how is the connectivity of data amongst those, you know, how is the power, how is the relative power between each of those hubs, et cetera, et cetera. So similarly, there are networks you can study and analyze for memory, mood, addiction, anxiety, sleep, chronic pain, autonomous nervous system issues, all of that.

So Kumar.

Ryan:Why do you focus on the whole brain, including the subconscious when you're trying to map it out with these gadgets? What's the logic of it? Why not just focus on only the awake part of the brain or the knowledgeable part of the brain?

Bargodia:You know, today, neurotechnology has move leaps and bounds and our fascination with making gadgets and variables out of everything sometimes can backfire.

So we see a lot of these contraptions out in the market. Which promote that you should be able to get a sense of your own brain function. But it's, I would just say that the marketing has far exceeded the actual science there. And it's fraught with issues because if you're not able to understand your subconscious brain function, then what you're really getting is just an assessment of your mood or attention in that moment.

silent:Hmm.

Bargodia:And. A, that is useless and B, you should not be making any real decisions on how to change on the basis of that, right? So your mood will change with your glucose level, with the temperature outside whether somebody fought with you, whether you recently just got a promotion or a raise, whatever it is.

That's not your pattern, that's not who you are, that's just a response to the environment. And as the environment changes, so does your brain's response. What we need to figure out is who are you, what makes you you, right? And to do that, one first thing you need to check is, am I mapping the cerebellum as well?

Right? Like I said, it's got 80 percent of the neurons. So it'll be ridiculous to use technology, which is not able to calculate or at least estimate brainwaves from your cerebral. That's one. You need to be able to have sensors all over your head. So just these things which are, you know, six or eight or ten sensors, that's, it's trash.

And the third thing is, Please stay away from using AI on your brain. That is scary. The world's largest AI companies, the world's largest tech companies have demonstrated that yes, AI can develop a bias. Would you want your brain to be affected by AI and have a bias which creeps in? We are dealing with human intelligence.

Let's just work on human intelligence. Let's not, you know, let's not mess around with it.

Ryan:You're like saying if I understood this correctly, you want to learn to run, right? So you put on a pair of proper running shoes and learn to run with your own legs rather than get some robotic bionic arms attached to your legs and you try and leapfrog 40 feet into the air, but you really don't know how to run, so therefore you don't even know how to land.

And you crash and burn certainly. Absolutely. But this goes into the sci fi realm. And I think Elon Musk recently, they did an integration of a chip to the brain. So is my nativity saying, or my knowledge, is there some sort of mapping that these tech companies are doing? And then they're putting chips on top of that, and then having a communication happening between the biological, which is your brain, and the silicon, which is the Chips that are there is, is something like this happening?

Partly,

Bargodia:partly. So we are on the absolute other extreme. Like I mentioned, we are non invasive, so we are not putting anything inside. There's no chip going in. There are no waves going in, but since you mentioned Elon's company, Neuralink they've actually implanted chips. But it is not just for brain function, it is to actually help with grave medical conditions or neurological conditions.

And that is one of several companies in the U. S. and across the world which are looking at invasive brain computer interfaces. Ours is non invasive. I think in our lifetime we will have the opportunity to actually have a chip inside our brain. for better memory, for better communication, all kinds of things, which we have not even imagined, but a lot of this will be possible within the next five to 10 years.

Ryan:So I'm just thinking in my head. Okay. So I come to NeuroLeap. I get this space age gadget put on my head and I read my brain, my brain patterns are red. You probably are comparing it to all the research that has happened in terms of which areas producing which signal. And hey, Ryan Fernando, this area of your brain is producing this signal.

Then what? So, do you kind of, reprogram it? So that's because I'm thinking you said, let's not get AI coming in and reprogramming you, right?

Ryan (2): Yeah.

Ryan:So if I'm coming to Neuralib. Then how am I getting better? Because if I get a blood test, I get a high cholesterol level and I keep eating all the oily foods and fried foods and sugary foods and not change my diet, then getting a blood test is useless.

So from the diagnostics and the reading of, what do you call it? It's a neurological pattern.

Bargodia:So it's called the brain function assessment. Okay. So we've done your assessment. So let me, let me add something interesting there. So we've got, let's say. Two sets of clients, I would say, broadly. One set of clients don't have disorders.

They are not going through anxiety, depression, or a sleep issue, or addiction, nothing. They're executives, homemakers, bankers you know, entrepreneurs, bureaucrats. They're, they're doing very well. They have no issues. But they're curious about their brain or they, like I said earlier, they realize that they're at a point in time in their careers or in their lives where they can take a bigger leap.

Or how can they take a bigger leap? How can they sustain themselves? Right? What do they need to do with their brain to do that? And that's why they come in and do the assessment. The second set of clients would be people who have a real issue, you know, sleep, anxiety, eating disorders, addictions.

Depression, et cetera. The WHO came up with a study in 2017, so three years before the pandemic, that one in five people in India have a mental health issue. All of these. I think post pandemic, it's anybody's guess. It's probably one in four, one in three. Think about it. When you are somebody who's been told you have, let's say ADHD or depression, so you've been labeled.

Right? And when you Google, you've been told that, Hey, there's no way to solve that. You just remain on meds. It's like giving a person a life sentence that you will remain on these meds and you have a limitation. You have depression, you have anxiety. And I hate that labeling. Right? Because that was decided by a bunch of people, funded by a bunch of people who wanted to sell more meds and that's it.

What was the diagnosis for it? Is there a biomedical diagnosis for it? Not at all. So imagine if you're one of these sets and we are objectively able to tell you, Hey, you know what? This is why you get anxious. This is why you display these symptoms or these reactions or these behaviors. And it's not you.

It's just a bunch of patterns in your brain. So like you mentioned about a blood test if somebody has high cholesterol, it's not a label. It's just a parameter. Correct. And once you bring it down to a tangible parameter, which means it can be measured and it can be changed. So how do we change it? And I'm coming to that.

But do you realize how empowering and liberating that can be? Because I no longer have a label now. You don't need to feel that you're a label. It is just another parameter. Now, how do we change it? So since you mentioned about food let me give you the example of one of our clients. Who was overweight, right?

And not because he didn't know that he shouldn't be eating XYZ things, but he just couldn't control himself. We mapped his brain. We understood that A, he's anxiety eating, stress eating. B, food had become his mood enhancer. So whenever he was feeling sad or low, Or throwing in the word depressed he would resort to his happy food.

And third, he had started to then develop addictive tendencies to certain types of food. Why? Because the brain gets programmed that way. I'm not feeling good, I'll eat this, I'll feel better. Again, I'm not feeling good, I'll eat this, I'll feel better. Without figuring out a way to break that cycle. How can I feel better without eating?

There must be some other way to feel better. How can I recognize that I am overeating because I'm not feeling good? So once we understood that pattern, it is just a simple task of us rewarding the brain whenever the brain is performing slightly better, and I'll tell you how that's done. So you come for these enhancement sessions.

Again, all of the sensors, all of the technology is on your head. So the brain computer interface, which is a bunch of sensors, it's on your head. We are mapping your brain in real time. We are understanding what are your subconscious pattern in real time. You're looking at relating

Ryan:the client at that time with some TV or reading or asking them, there

Bargodia:is no stimulation whatsoever.

There is

Ryan:no, you just sit down and do the test.

Bargodia:So the test was already done, right? That was the brain assessment. Now, coming to the enhancement part. There's a television screen in front of you. All the sensors are on your head. And we've created a customized protocol just for you, on the basis of your assessment, on the basis of your data.

Every fraction of a second, when your brain performs at a certain level, if it meets our benchmark, you will be rewarded on the TV screen.

So You're just sitting, relaxing,

Ryan:or rather getting bored. You're basically gamifying my, my, my brainwave and saying that when, when it hits the right benchmark and you're tracking it, you get the next image.

Bargodia:No, there's no gamification, because you're not involved. You're not consciously doing anything.

You're just sitting, as you are right now. And you say, okay, I'm just relaxing, and I'm looking at the TV screen. Every time my brain waves, Meet a certain benchmark, a light will come on the screen, a sound will be played. That's it. That is my cue that I have performed better

because

Bargodia:I have no way to understand if I'm performing better or not, because I'm not doing an active task.

I'm not consciously meditating. I'm not consciously doing mental math or solving a you know, puzzle, nothing of that sort. I'm just sitting just relaxed. We keep monitoring these instances of rewards. And every few minutes we'll say, okay, this pattern has been rewarded enough at this level. Let's raise the bar.

And now we'll raise the bar just to simplify it in layman terms. I'll say, let's say we were earlier rewarding at X percent. Now we are at, okay, you need to be performing X plus 5 percent better. And, and we'll tell the client that, hey, we are raising the bar. The client still doesn't need to do anything.

They're just sitting, relaxing. But the subconscious brain realizes that it is suddenly not earning as many rewards as what It was doing earlier. So the frequency of rewards has dropped. Why has it dropped? Because the benchmark is higher and the brain almost magically starts moving towards the higher benchmark because it wants more reward.

So over a series of sessions, we keep mapping the brain, keep raising the bar, keep allowing the brain to beat that benchmark. So over a series of sessions, it has learned from within by itself. How to perform better that network. Think of it this way. We spoke about cricket again,

silent:right?

Bargodia:Let's say if the batsman is practicing a certain shot and he's got to hit it 500 times today for the first hundred shots.

The coach is observing. So here the coach is the sensors and the computer. That's the parallel. The coach is observing. And the television, which is giving the reward, is also the coach here. And he says, great shot. Second time, great shot. Third time, great shot. He's giving you feedback. That's how you know that I'm playing the right shot.

My form is correct. My wrist is correct. My toes are pointing correct. All of the technique, right? After the hundredth shot, You know, the, the batsman has kind of got that pattern somewhat sorted, not a hundred percent cemented, but he's getting into that. Mode little bit of that muscle memory as we call it is being created and the coach goes on a tea break Right, and he says, you know, you're doing well just keep practicing So hundred shots are done for the next 50 the batsman is practicing exactly the same way and then fatigue sets in So suddenly he's a little lax 10 percent lax in terms of his stance or in terms of his movement There's nobody to correct him that time.

Ryan:And the brain now says that, okay, this is, this is okay to do this. This

Bargodia:is okay to do for the remaining three 50 shots. That's what he's done. Imagine having to then correct. You would again go the next day and say, Oh, my form is bad again. Please visualize it. See it, correct it, give me feedback. Good, bad, good, bad.

And that's what we're doing. The difference is, one, we are understanding your subconscious. So which means we are understanding, let's say in the food example, the stress eating or the anxiety, that hey, if this network is at X and these are your symptoms and this network needs to be at X plus 100 percent, Let's keep rewarding the brain between x to x plus 100 slowly, slowly, slowly, slowly, so that from within the network becomes corrected, trained, and working at an optimal level without any interference of AI.

without any interference of any programming. So we are not programming your brain. We are relying on your brain's own ability. And what is that ability? That every human brain wants progress. So all we have told your brain is that if you see this light and sound, which means it's a reward, if you see this reward, means you're progressing.

Then my task is to keep moving the benchmark, keep moving that reward benchmark higher and higher, So the, our brain seeking progress keeps improving. So,

Ryan:you know, as a nutritionist eating disorders, and you're talking about it specifically right now, do you see with these case studies that how many sessions are there required to say somebody who's got an eating disorder, either say nervosa or bulimia or emotional eating?

So how quickly can it be resolved? How long is your longest case? So I wouldn't

Bargodia:want to give a very generalized answer

Ryan:because once we do an individual,

Bargodia:right, once we do the assessment it can be very surprising that a person comes in with anorexia nervosa, but actually has PTSD and the anorexia is a by product of the PTSD.

So then we don't even bother about the anorexia. For

Ryan:those of us who are not familiar with these terms, what is PTSD?

Bargodia:Sorry post traumatic stress disorder.

Ryan:And I could get PTSD after some incident or something like that? Absolutely. So it could be war, it could be anything that was traumatic to the brain.

Bargodia:Right. Could be anything, you know, a bad breakup loss of a job, loss of a near one. Could be anything. Right. Which your brain is not ready to handle well. And so the underlying is most important. Understanding why is there an eating disorder. That a person has an eating disorder is easy, right?

Ryan:So this stress disorder that has come.

This post traumatic stress, it hits a certain part of the brain. And that's why brain mapping is able to detect that this person's frequencies are coming in that area of the brain.

Bargodia:It's not just a part of the brain. Like I said, it's certain networks, certain patterns. So

Ryan:it's able to see those patterns.

So

Bargodia:we are able to understand those patterns and say, okay, these are signatures of patterns. Similar to trauma.

Ryan:So one is to have the negative of eating. What if I told you I had a brilliant guy, very disciplined, eats everything correctly. Would that person's brain being mapped or forget eating? Let's take Virat Kohli, for example, one of the greatest cricketers in the world.

And we map Virat's brain and we have a budding 16 year old. Is there something that we would see as a pattern from a Virat Kohli's brain that maybe somebody else's brain could then be like, you are here at this level and Virat's brain mapping for that square cut shot is here, right? So is that where brain mapping is going to ultimately be going as a coach?

Bargodia:Not really. Okay. You know, so we get enough parents who will say, Hey, make my son smarter in maths. and science. I'm like, that's not, that's not the way it works. You need, yes, we can help with mathematical ability or you know, logical reasoning, et cetera, those brain functions. But it's incorrect to say that one can cherry pick.

a certain behavior trait from one person and replicate it in another person. What you can aim for and what we do is how to have optimal function of your specific pattern. So your anxiety network, how can I get it to operate at its optimal? We are all endowed with a certain brain reserve, which is certain number of neurons, you know, certain chemistry, certain biology.

Within that, how can we. make it optimal for you. So yes if I look at a brain of a high performer, whether it's sports or cinema or politics or business, we will notice certain traits, which we find are common. Now, a lot of that commonality comes about because of the demands of the profession because of the lifestyle that person then leads.

So over a period of years, you will start noticing that, okay, if you're in this, And you've been sort of throwing yourself completely at that life. You will see certain patterns emerge.

Okay.

Bargodia:Right. Can you replicate that pattern from one individual to the other? It's not desirable. It's not desirable because then you're cherry picking.

Without giving due importance to the individual as a whole, right? So like I said,

Ryan:Each person fine tune and betters their own mapping sequence. Absolutely.

Bargodia:You are, you are improving yourself, right? Getting to a newer you, a better you, newer bests.

Ryan:I'm smiling because of two things. I recently watched a movie on Netflix of the integration of AI.

to human. And Jennifer Lopez was the lead, leading actor in there and how the, they talked about AI being detrimental in the first hundred years and then how it evolved to such a level where the humans actually sync to AI. So brain mapping was one of the processes. I'm also smiling because I suddenly remembered right now in this podcast, when I was studying for my 10th standard exam, my dad bought these specs for me that had lights and you had to sleep with it.

True. And you had headphones and you would play subliminal messages. True. I think it was a silver mind control something like that, which was many years ago. And I just remembered there was those flashing lights. And I don't know if it really helped me, but I do remember that I was able to study a little longer than I actually was.

Bargodia:That's called brainwave entrainment.

Ryan:So this is where we're talking about. I train my own brain because I've got some sort of pattern coming to me. And the other one is mapping your own brain and then trying to get to the next level.

Bargodia:Yeah. You know, since you mentioned about food again, yes, it is possible to say I have all of these eating disorders.

Or I don't even know I have an eating disorder. I'm just assuming I am somebody who have, who has less willpower and less self discipline when it comes to food, right? Most of us will believe that when you do the brain map and you realize that, hey, discipline is not a problem. Willpower is not a problem.

You having underlying anxiety issue or underlying trauma or underlying body image issues, or your default mode network is a problem where. You are overtly self reflective, right? And to compensate for that, you are either eating too little, too much, going out and gagging.

Ryan:So everything is a behavioral process coming from the root stem of the brain.

Bargodia:Absolutely. It is all a behavioral process. Your entire eating habits Are part of a behavioral process. It starts, like I said, before you eat. So rather than what should I eat? The question then is why am I eating?

Ryan:That's deep. Why am I? That's brain deep. Why am I eating? Right? So if. Yeah, because most of the human race doesn't need to eat that much, right?

Exactly. For survival. Exactly. Then why do we push that envelope of calories and everything? Exactly. Oh, I would love to have like a hundred people and just do their mind mapping, give them a diet plan, give them nutrition, give them supplementation, and then just see how their patterns before and after like a blood test before and after like a weighing scale before and after.

And this is your

Bargodia:brain pattern before and after. But more importantly, imagine. A pro athlete who's got the best diet and who's very disciplined. If they were to be able to understand how their brain is functioning and what is the role of food in their brain, not from a nutrition perspective, but from a performance perspective.

So that's what we are doing. And hence, I was hesitant to give you a blanket number of how many sessions it will take to solve an eating disorder. But let's say any one of these things we discussed. It takes about 15, 20, 30 sessions even for a certain pattern to be changed from within. And to be changed for good.

Have you worked with any

Ryan:smokers on this?

Bargodia:Lots. We help people quit smoking, quit marijuana hard drugs, alcohol. So

Ryan:addiction problem actually also starts not only at the neurochemistry level, but then at the, the pattern that you see.

silent:Yeah.

Ryan:It's addiction

Bargodia:is a subconscious problem. Absolutely. It is.

There is no addiction, which is a problem of

Ryan:the conscious mind. There is no addiction, which is a problem of the conscious mind. Wow. Let me prove it to you.

Bargodia:Do you know smokers?

Yes.

Bargodia:Yeah. If you see a cigarette box, it has ghastly images of cancer, etc. Those images didn't exist on those boxes 10, 15, 20 years ago.

Correct. It was just a warning. Correct. Cigarette smoking is injurious to health. Why? Because the warning was a direct message to your consciousness that please don't smoke. You go to the cinema hall, don't smoke, don't smoke. Netflix, don't promote smoking, right? It is appealing to your knowledge base, your awareness that smoking is injurious.

But then authorities realize that it's no longer a problem of knowledge. You know it's bad for you. You're still not able to quit because it has become part of your subconscious that I'm feeling anxious. I'll just light up and take a few puffs. Right. I'm, I'm feeling a little edgy. I light up. Oh, I've had a long one hour meeting.

I'm tired. I need to pep myself up here. I'll go and light up. Right. I'm at the discotheque or at the pub. You know, it's my vibe. I need to hold my cigarette in a certain way and feel cool. Right? I light up. So it's all programming from the past. It's all programming from months, years, decades. Why were the images given there?

To then jar the subconscious that, Oh my God, what is this? I don't need to be told that cigarette smoking is injurious to health. I just look at that image and say, Oh God, this is ghastly. So which is appealing to my inner senses. Right? Tell me any chain smoker, you know, who's illiterate,

Ryan:none, not, not, no, I don't know.

Most of the ones are literate. Yes.

Bargodia:Are they educated? Yes. Most of them are very successful. Lawyers, doctors, doctors, engineers, engineers, businessmen, billionaires, billionaires, right? We see all of these people as our clientele. Why are they not able to quit smoking? They are rational individuals, right? So when I say rational means, they are conscious that smoking is bad for them.

Ryan:But their subconscious is at another plane, which they haven't Is at the base. They haven't gone into battle at that mode as yet. They've not been able to,

Bargodia:right? And it's not because they are weak or they have low self discipline. That's another programming area. Yeah, it is. It is just a pattern, right? And everyone can quit.

They can go cold turkey. With the right circumstances, but not everyone has those circumstances. Not everyone has the need. Not everyone has the desire, but using our process, we've helped people do all of this. Like I said, alcohol. I've had clients who would drink an entire bottle of whiskey every day.

Would

Ryan:hate to see the blood test of that guy.

Bargodia:And he would joke, he would say, Oh, I am born with four livers. Three months completely clean, sober in March this year, we celebrated his fifth year of being sober after three months of therapy with us. So

Ryan:now he's gone from a bottle of alcohol to cold turkey or maybe once in a social occasion he has a

Bargodia:glass.

He's like, I don't care. You know, if I want to taste wine, I might, but I don't care. Earlier, if he saw a bottle of alcohol or a peg. He had to have it. He's been to rehab all across the world, Switzerland, Florida, Bangalore, Ashram in Bangalore, Ashram in Coimbatore. All of the stuff has been done. And he said, but every time I came back out of that lovely environment, which was prohibitive, right?

So I didn't see the product. Every time I came back, I saw the product and I wanted to have it. And that's when he came to us as a last resort. He said, I've tried everything.

Ryan:Is this similar to hypnotherapy?

Bargodia:There is no human involvement of speaking getting you to follow any advice, nothing.

Ryan:Sukumar, why is this technology not being easily accessible everywhere?

Bargodia:Look, every technology, every pathbreaking technology will have its own adoption curve. So we are on that adoption curve. But given that it deals with behavior change and habit change, unfortunately, we have all now relegated our health, and unfortunately, our mind also, the white coat, unfortunately, right?

And

Ryan:the

Bargodia:pills. And the pills. So, and we've not realized that that's what gotten those economies, those societies into graver trouble. And we are hurtling down that path.

Ryan:Oh yeah. I said this the other day in a podcast, you're becoming the youngest, sickest population in the world.

Bargodia:And because we are blindly adopting whatever is propagated, right?

There is enough research now to say. There is no chemical imbalance in the brain when it comes to depression. In

Ryan:fact, that's a very, very interesting point. You said there is no chemical imbalance in the brain. In fact, Dr. Daniel Amen talks about this saying that psychiatrists are the only doctors on the planet that treat an organ, which is the brain.

Absolutely. Without looking into the brain.

Bargodia:Absolutely.

Ryan:You know, so, and, and that's, that's so powerful because when people come to me now, I'm not a doctor, but we have had so many people in terms of just finding out that they have a simple omega three deficiency and 60 percent of your brain is made up of good fat.

Yeah.

Ryan:So coming back to the brain I think where I would like to start with the brain is at level zero. I don't a layman term level zero is I'm sleeping. Right. So. I get good sleep. I, I know that I made friends with a sleep doctor and he says, dude, if you're getting more than seven hours, seven and a half hours of sleep, you will fire at the next level of performance of thinking of whatever it is.

And I kind of agree with that. So now in brain mapping at NeuroLeap, we know that sleep is crucial to health. In sleep studies, we've seen that they map the, the brainwaves, the REM cycle Sure. And assigned wave sleep and stuff like that. What is it that you do with that in terms of one, I can improve my sleep even if I don't have a problem, or people who are insomniacs.

What does brain mapping do and help and how do you take it to the next level?

Bargodia:So first off, we are not doing a sleep study. Mm-hmm. We are not mapping your brain when you are trying to fall asleep or when you're sleeping. It's just in a steady state. Usually, bad sleep or insomnia of any sort again stems from either over arousal or anxiety issues or overthinking or a mood disorder or trauma or some other autonomous nervous system issues.

Most of these we are able to figure out in that original brain assessment we do. So rather than trying to get you to sleep better, fix those areas, go to the root cause, right? Like we say, Hey, so what keeps you up awake at night? We'll ask people, right? Exactly. What's keeping you up awake at night? There's got to be a reason, right?

And then some people will say, Hey, well, you know, there's no reason, there's just no reason. I just can't fall asleep. And that's when the data helps us saying, what's

Ryan:been your most memorable case in sleep?

Bargodia:Well, actually one of them, we've not been able to solve. That's the most memorable one.

Ryan:So that's like a challenge.

That's like a Mount Everest for you.

Bargodia:No. So it's, it's because the, this gentleman is also an alcoholic and that's the overstimulus part to the brain. And he refuses to. Solve his alcohol problem because he believes it's not a problem. So there was a period in between where for a few weeks we got him to stop.

And whilst we were doing therapy and his sleep had tremendously improved, not got absolutely sorted, but improved by multiples. And but then he said, no, I'm not going to, I'm going to fish

Ryan:a little bit over here on this concept. I was dating a girl long time ago.

Bargodia:Okay. We are going there now. We're going there.

Ryan:The podcast is going to get interesting right now. And she said to me, I think it would be really cool if you smoked, because once I lit a cigarette and I smoked. My father and mother have never smoked. Many years later I discovered, her father used to smoke.

silent:Exactly.

Ryan:Now we're talking about this drinking question.

Do you believe that the behavioral patterns, or the brainwave patterns, or whatever, One of the recipient signals is visual. So as a child hears a parent, of course, sees a parent, smells a parent, there is some imprinting on the brainwave patterns. Of course, all of it.

Bargodia:We are a product of our environment.

Our actions and the repercussions or lack of it. So regarding your ex girlfriend, she said it'll be cool if you smoke, right? Which means you would be validated if you lit up a cigarette.

Correct.

Bargodia:So you were being rewarded with your ex girlfriend's attention and favorable attention. Imagine if she had said that, hey, if you smoke, that's going to be disgusting.

You wouldn't smoke,

Ryan:correct? Right. But there's a pre primer over there, which is, I was at an age where I was already an adult, but probably had my parents smoked, then I would have already thought it really cool and not resisted. Yes and no. I'm saying this because I know thousands of teenagers that just get influenced and their parents don't smoke.

And there are thousands of teenagers who smoke just because their parents smoke.

Bargodia:Look I think. It's easy to blame parents I mean, I'm sure the parents are doing several other good things, which that child is not doing because those are more difficult to do and not as pleasurable. Right? So they might be having a glass of karele ka juice every morning,

Ryan:which

Bargodia:is bitter, but the kids, why is the kid not having that?

Yeah. Right. Or he's running a mile every morning or waking up at six. Right. Or 5 a. m. So, it goes both ways. I see cases where, especially for alcohol and smoking, where the child has seen the ill effects of alcoholism and chain smoking. And don't

Ryan:touch it at all.

Bargodia:They don't touch it because they've seen either domestic violence or that you know, somebody in the family consuming too much alcohol.

always misbehaving, et cetera, et cetera. And they don't want to be that person. So it cuts both ways.

Ryan:So this was the Himalaya case for you that not able to solve the problem, but

Bargodia:in general, I wouldn't say Himalaya case. I think we were, we were very clear why it's not solvable because the underlying is alcohol.

And until, until we can convince the person to quit alcohol, we will not be able to solve his sleep. Do you think

Ryan:mainstream medicine and doctors? In, in the next few years, we'll begin to open their eyes to neuro programming.

Bargodia:Look, I, I wouldn't call it neuro programming, but Or self discovery. Yeah.

Self discovery or just, you know, treating the person, not the illness.

Ryan:Cause I've seen that the watches have really helped just on the number of steps. People know they're inactive and then they start getting more active.

Bargodia:Well, I have my own theory there because this technology actually is very, very harmful.

at a cellular level.

Ryan:Can you tell me about this? Yeah,

Bargodia:that's a whole two hour podcast. But yeah, I can send you some research. So please don't wear that. Okay. Okay. So that's another podcast coming

Ryan:up.

Bargodia:But Yes I do see a change happening. Look at the top three disorders or illnesses, diabetes, hypertension, high cholesterol.

These are actually largely lifestyle issues, right? Unfortunately, again, we've relegated ourselves to saying, I will take a pill for my diabetes, one for my hypertension, and, you know, something to keep my cholesterol in check, right? There is a slew. of health professionals now who have taken it upon themselves good startups, good practices who are reversing people's diabetes, reversing hypertension, reversing high cholesterol, just with diet and lifestyle changes.

So it, I think a movement has begun, but it's very, very small because not everyone has the faith. Not everyone has the belief that my health can be sold by me and with the right guidance alone. and doesn't require medicine. And honestly, is that pill really medicine? Because the medicine in my book should be able to cure.

Ryan:True. I remember my dad one day telling me my, my, my diabetes is under control. I said, your diabetes is not under control. You're taking medication, which is controlling it. But if you want your diabetes to be under control or disappear, do it without medicine. And then you are controlling your diabetes.

But coming back to, we talked about these three lifestyle issues. I see a lot of clients with anxiety. And obviously, look, I know as a nutritionist, magnesium, omega three, changing the gut microbiome, because they produce the wrong molecules, which go to your brain, the gut brain access. But a lot of them are on Antidepressant, anti anxiety, anti suicidal medicines, or whatever you call those range of drugs.

So how does brain mapping help in a small way or a large way in anxiety?

Bargodia:We've been able to help people get off their anti anxiety medication, antidepressants SSRIs, benzos. Sorry, these are just the type of medications which they take. We've had clients who've been on these medications from six months to even 30 years who've been living on anti anxiety pills.

By the way, sleep medication, most of the people are actually prescribed anti anxiety pills and they are told this is for your sleep. They don't even realize that they are taking an anti anxiety pill. Most of them.

silent:Yeah.

Bargodia:So using the same process that I described earlier, we're actually able to help them start tapering their medicines whilst they are doing the therapy with us.

So over a few months, they're off the meds, as well as the brain patterns are at a level where they don't require medication to be responding to their environment like a normal individual would. We have a lot of people who come and say, Oh, so I'll have zero anxiety. I'm like, no, if you have zero anxiety, you end up doing something stupid and kill yourself or hurt yourself, right?

Zero anxiety is you, you know, probably drunk or probably smoking something up where you can go and stand in the middle of a road in front of a speeding car because you don't know self preservation that time. You don't know what's good for you in your immediate environment. So we don't have to aim for zero anxiety.

You have to aim for your anxiety network, your mood network to be able to function. At a level where it is not triggered by everyday events, where it is not triggered to a level where you start palpitating, going into a panic mode, et cetera, et cetera.

Ryan:I'm going to ask the tough question that everyone might ask out there.

Is this hocus pocus? Because the doctors, you know, when I started genetic testing in India, I was trolled by hundreds of doctors in the early. 2009, 10, 11, when people are not heard about nutrigenomics and genetic testing as the science is too early and all, but we're looking at simple genes like the ACT3N gene, which is the sprint gene and stuff like that.

But in today's day and age, it's become mainstream and all the doctors are talking about it. I genuinely believe that this in the next five years is going to become mainstream, that you need to study your brain. Before you go to the nutritionist, you need to study your brain before you go to the exercise physiologist, you need to study your brain before you go to dance class, you need to study your brain before you go for the, so is this hocus pocus right now?

Bargodia:Can I stop you there? Yeah. No, you don't need to study your brain before you go for exercise and dance. And even nutrition, honestly, right? I would hate that it becomes mainstream where people are doing it out of fear. They're, Oh, I think it's curiosity. I think it's more of

Ryan:curiosity. I

Bargodia:think there should only be two broad reasons why you would want to study your brain.

One, like I said, you don't feel anything abnormal or anything off. You're curious and you're a high performer. You want to do better in life. That's one. Two, if you genuinely have an issue, then you should study your brain. Because that's the only way you'll understand why that issue is there. Okay. Got it.

It's important to understand the why. The why. Let me add one thing. A lot of the CEOs, a lot of the top bureaucrats or high performers, they believe that they have reached a certain stage in their career profession. Life. Life. Because of their idiosyncrasies. So they'll come in and tell me, Hey, you know, don't, don't solve my anxiety completely.

Because that's what makes me perform. And I'm like, no, that's bollocks. You should be able to go out and perform with some other motivation, a positive motivation, rather than the fear of failure. Rather than being anxious of coming second. Please try hard to come first for the thrill of coming first. Not for the fear of coming second.

So yes, anxiety has gotten you to a certain point. That also meant that your brain and your body was able to take that level of stress. In your younger years, at your middle ages and older age, you will not be able to take that level of stress. Your brain starts depleting physically with that level of stress and anxiety.

It has a role on your hypertension, your heart function, your liver function, your gut function, your brain. Through the nervous system is pretty much controlling everything and all of these manifestations of disease you're seeing is a part of your stress and anxiety response or mood response. So I would actually tell everyone that please don't assume that what got you here is the way to live going forward.

Understand what got you there. Great. But that doesn't mean you can't have a even better journey going forward, performing better, being calmer, being happier. So Transcribed

Ryan:If we wanted to pick your brains and you have had experience testing all of these people, one, you have said it does not involve a lot of human intervention.

Bargodia:In the sense there is no counseling. You don't need to, that's, that's actually one of the USPs that we have. I'm thinking

Ryan:because a high flying CEO or bureaucrat would not want to listen to a young techie neuroscientist. Forget about

Bargodia:listening. I'm saying, why should I give you my life story? I'm working on major transactions, movie scripts, or whatever.

You're a stranger. Fine, I'm paying you whatever 200 or 500 are. I don't want to give you my life story. Why should I?

Ryan:Makes sense.

Bargodia:I'd rather talk to my parents or my school buddies or college mates who know me. Why do I come to you for 50 sessions for the first 50 sessions? You're only understanding me.

Ryan:That's bizarre. Right. In fact, I had, I had somebody tell me the other day saying that she was on medication, depression, and she realized that the, the person, the medical professional sitting on the other side was actually not listening to her and had already pre prescribed the medicines for that session.

But that's, that's, that's going down one rabbit hole

Bargodia:coming to us. So, so the USP I was telling you is that we don't need you to tell us. So, yes, I will know that anxiety is a factor for you, but you don't need to tell me why you're anxious. Are you anxious that your boss is the most powerful man? in some country and he's not liking the way of functioning.

Is that your anxiety or are you anxious that you're going to flunk in an exam?

Ryan:That sounded like a mob boss.

Bargodia:Or are you, are you anxious that you're going to be found?

Ryan:So, so it's basically you're telling me it's incognito mode when you do neuromapping.

Bargodia:There are clients whom I have, I would have met for the first time.

After I have seen their brain assessment report, I have not met them.

Ryan:And this can't be done remotely. No, you need the device to be sitting on top of your head. So obviously I want to kind of ask like a get one, buy one free kind of question. For all our podcasters and fans listening out over there, which is, are there any strategies that when you do brain mapping, right?

You've got it. And you're able to see human patterns and like, okay, this is this you can eat, or this is this that you can do to enhance your mitochondria brain function. Just like two, three tips.

Bargodia:Certainly lots of them. You know, you mentioned mitochondria and I think somewhere in the beginning you had mentioned about energy as far as the subconscious brain goes and looking at enhancing it.

I look at it at two levels. One is the patterns, which is what our practice at NeuroLeap does. Helping understand your subconscious patterns and help you enhance them. We mentioned earlier, we don't do any reprogramming, the brain does it. Let's come to the second part, which is the energy. Your brain consumes one third of your body's energy.

So as a nutritionist, when you're looking at a person's lifestyle, let's say a CEO. Who's not necessarily practicing for the marathon or is not into heavy gym.

Ryan:14, 1500 calories. So about 500 calories go for brain performance alone. Exactly. A minimum. And that's why the CEOs tend to crave a lot of sugars because you're constantly thinking, thinking, thinking, thinking.

Bargodia:You'd be surprised how much the average high performer, if I can say, is utilizing their brain. Not because they are thinking consciously, it's subconscious thought, which is consuming most of your stuff.

Ryan:That makes logical sense because the beginning you said so many MBPS per second and you

Bargodia:11 MBPS of data,

Ryan:but the other one was just 50, 50 bytes.

Bargodia:Yeah, 50 bits per second is your consciousness that what you can process. So let me give you an example. What color shirt am I wearing?

Ryan:How did you decide it was blue? My eyes would have seen it and they processed it to my brain and

Bargodia:Exactly. So there is a memory coder. But you didn't have to consciously say, oh, this is looking like blue and I would Random excess memory like It's, it's there.

It happens like that, but you have fired billions of neurons. And trillions of connections were fired in that instance for your eye to visually see this, understand it's blue and respond. You know, have you ever noticed, Ryan, that you'll go to, let's say a mall and after an hour of no window shopping, nothing, you're just observing, doing stuff.

You're physically tired. It's a lovely air conditioned mall, but you're tired. Why?

Ryan:Too much of visual stimulation?

Bargodia:All of it, sights, sounds, lights, colors, mannequins, designs, brands. And your brain is just processing it, processing it, processing it, processing it.

Ryan:No wonder I get irritated with my wife when we go shopping because I'm like, I want to buy the first thing, logical finish, no brain processing power after that.

And she has to go through 40, 000 variations, even if she's already liked the first variation. And now I get it.

Bargodia:So if you're. Brain is consuming so much of your energy. Shouldn't your daily diet plan and what you eat, when you eat, be prescribed according to what you do?

Ryan:Absolutely. Like a chess player's diet is completely different from a cricketer's diet as compared to completely different from a boxer's diet.

Bargodia:I don't mean from your physical profession. Then from what perspective? On what you actually do. Not in terms of what you're doing physically. But what does your task involve? So what happens up here in your kopdi? What happens up here, right? If you're able to assess somebody's brain and say, hmm, lot of anxiety that the person says and this happens with me almost So when you get, this happens with you almost all the time?

Almost all the time. I will have somebody sit in front of me and I'll say, hey, you know, so your anxiety network is dysregulated. Or your attention network is dysregulated.

Ryan:What are the different networks that you have? So we look at

Bargodia:attention, anxiety, mood, chronic pain. So chronic pain, basically any sort of autonomous nervous system issue, default, addiction, salience, executive function.

What is salience? Your ability, the brain's ability to process important information, to prioritize tasks.

Ryan:Is that the reason why some people, they have to catch a flight, but they don't process it as important information? I would love to know that. It's not just that. It's not as easy as that. Me and my better half are coming in for a test.

It's not just that. Do couples come together for brain mapping? Have you ever had a couple together?

I mean, I wouldn't say they come together,

Bargodia:you know, but you are

Ryan:doing families. Yeah,

Bargodia:usually somebody is dragging the other.

Ryan:And, and if, if my listeners or our fans want to reach out and, and do the testing we're going to be putting the link in the description below where you can get in touch with Kumar and that can help out people to map their brains and have lesser fights on the mall if you're getting overstimulated.

Bargodia:So coming back to brain energy, like I mentioned, the brain consumes one third of your energy. What are some of the ways to help understand your energy and your brain function? So we are aware of mitochondria, which are small organelles in every cell of your body. The mitochondria are your powerhouse.

They generate energy for all your bodily functions. I would say the primary role of nutrition or food is to help the mitochondria generate energy. The primary role of breathing is so that the mitochondria can generate energy. Let me give you a quick example to tell you how much mitochondria play a role in your brain function.

Each cell in your body has a different number of mitochondria depending on how much function it has to. Your liver cells probably have 1 to 2, 000 mitochondria per liver cell. Your heart, about 5, 000 mitochondria per heart cell. The human egg. Okay. Each cell in the human egg has about half a million mitochondria.

Ryan:Whoa! Half a million?

Bargodia:Each neuron.

Ryan:Hmm.

Bargodia:So we have about a hundred billion neurons in the brain.

Okay.

Bargodia:That's 10, 000 crore neurons in the brain. This small part. Each of those hundred billion neurons, 2 million mitochondria.

Ryan:That's

Bargodia:like the most

Ryan:populated city on the planet as compared to wow.

Bargodia:So, your mitochondria generate ATP.

adenosine triphosphate. The human brain consumes about six kg of ATP a day.

Ryan:That's phenomenal. So the brain in chess players really uses a lot of energy.

Bargodia:Well, not just chess players. This is an average person's brain. Six kilograms of ATP on an average, your brain is consuming. And an average human being who's broadly active is consuming his body weight in ATP every day.

Ryan:Say that again.

Bargodia:If you weigh 50 kgs, and you are broadly active, I don't mean, you know, running every day, etc. But just normally active, out and about, you are consuming 50 kgs of ATP, equivalent to your body weight, every day.

So there is a mitochondrial theory of aging.

Okay.

Bargodia:And mitochondrial disorders.

Okay.

Bargodia:A lot of the chronic diseases that we have are actually disorders of the mitochondria. We age faster or slower because of mitochondria. So the depletion in mitochondrial function is faster than the kind of energy it is able to generate to heal.

and repair the bodily processes.

One of the ways to then increase your energy is to increase your brain energy. No point trying to go after improving your skin from the surface or trying to give yourself more energy from the skin because your average cell has about a hundred mitochondria. Your average brain cell has 2 million mitochondria.

So 2 million raised to 100 billion. Why would you not go out and just improve the mitochondria function of your brain? That'll take care of your entire body by and large. Fatigue, energy, rest, repair, mood, anxiety, all of it. Better collagen production, antioxidants, anti inflammation. Why? Because the brain suddenly has more energy.

Now the problem is, to improve mitochondrial function, either you eat more, or you breathe more oxygen. Both of these are inefficient in a way, because you're consuming more calories, and your body has to digest more. You're breathing more means you're expending more energy as well, doing some fast breathing activity, etc.

But, pranayama is really important, pranayama is really good, so please do that. So, in comes the third solution. Which has been used since time immemorial light as medicine photo waves. It's called photo bio modulation photo bio modulation Using light to modulate your biology. So in ancient times it was called heliotherapy

Okay,

Bargodia:heliotherapy was simply using the sun's rays as medicine

Ryan:That explains why I get into my garden and just get 10 minutes of sun and I feel like a solar powered battery back charged up again.

Okay, now I get the perspective.

Bargodia:No, but it's, I'm glad you said that. So it's not just any light.

Okay.

Bargodia:Mitochondria are best energized when they absorb near infrared light. Ah,

Ryan:so, so, so the mitochondria, if they were solar powered cells, they would say, Hey, give me only near infrared light and I can recharge myself.

Bargodia:Not only, but near infrared light is what kicks off a series of processes in mitochondria Where they are able to generate higher ATP. Okay, and several other things which they generate which improve vasodilation so you can actually improve your blood pressure you can improve your glucose Your diabetes, you can improve inflammation, you can improve antioxidant benefits, boost collagen.

And these are all proven scientifically across the world. So photobiomodulation is the modern avatar of heliotherapy of ancient times. Even in Ayurveda, which has been around for 5, 000 years. There was a reason why we were told to wake up at a certain hour and do certain things because at that point in time you would get natural near infrared light.

So today, the easiest thing you can do is use near infrared light of specific wavelengths, specific frequencies to charge up your mitochondria, generate higher ATP. And that ATP was generated without you eating more. without you expending energy in terms of exercise to generate that higher amount of ATP.

So which means this is excess ATP available to your body and nervous system. Available to do what? Fight inflammation, fight disease, heal your wounds better, have better collagen, better antioxidant and hence age better. So if you study mitochondrial aging and mitochondrial disorders, one will realize that The role of mitochondria is now far above food or chemistry in your body.

Ryan:All because the mitochondria has 2 million numbers in the neuron cell.

Bargodia:Well, not just in the neuron cell. I mean, we have mitochondria pretty much most places, but they are in far smaller concentration levels. This is the amazing part of nature. It gave that many powerhouses. In those cells, which actually need that much power and the brain required the most, the brain requires the most, right?

Even when you're sleeping, your brain is burning energy, even when you're in deep sleep. So if you look at the hierarchy, 2 million in the brain, in each cell of the brain, rather half a million, or let's say 600, 000. In each human egg cell. Why? Because the egg cell has to do a lot of work once to fertilize and, you know, move ahead.

Heart, maybe about 5, 000 per heart cell. Liver, 1 to 2, 000. Skin, maybe a hundred. Human sperm cell, maybe just one. That's why you need millions of sperms to do their job. In a way, this actually goes back to our Vedic wisdom. All of our bodily functions, we assume it is about what we take in through our mouth.

But most of it is urja or energy food is, but one of the ways to manage that energy breath work is another light is another and sleep, of course.

Ryan:So now I'm going to ask you the question, how do I biohack this?

Bargodia:Well, it's not just about biohacking. So one is, Hey, you know, wake up at those hours when you're going to get the best.

Quality of natural, near infrared light, but not just waking up, then you need to be in certain yogic postures so that the light actually reaches the underside of your brain unfiltered through your skull. Oh, so light can actually enter through your nostrils. Correct. You know, there's a nasal cavity.

Correct. Right. So you can actually pass something from your nostril directly to the underside of your brain. So we have come up with. India's first therapeutic wearable device.

Okay.

Bargodia:It's a wearable which does not measure anything. No steps, no glucose, no heartbeat, no pulse, nothing. It only gives you therapy by giving you red and near infrared light.

Right into your nostrils, going straight up into your brain, being absorbed so that you can have higher energy, better response to stress, anxiety, better sleep. By the way, near infrared light when done correctly and absorbed by the mitochondria actually improves your melatonin production.

Ryan:Which gives me better sleep.

Yeah, so it's proven. Hmm. Oh, this is absolutely true because I tell all my clients that the pituitary gland senses the sunset and sets about a cascade of biochemistry reactions in the brain to ultimately produce melatonin. So I remember reading this, that sunset orange light triggers the pituitary or the pineal, I don't remember correctly, one of those who then cascade down to the melatonin and so absolutely bang on and my yoga instructor always telling me when I'm doing the exercise of certain ones he says you want to be having your head tilted back and facing the sun and I never thought about it but now like oh yeah sunshine up my nose.

Bargodia:Yeah, but you know, by the time you're doing that, if you're already seeing the sunlight, you're not getting near infrared near infrared light is invisible

if you're already seeing the light. It's so that's why they say that early morning hours, one and a half hours before sunrise before visible sunrise. That's why it becomes a little tricky and impractical. So hence you have devices available to do that job for you. And You know, photobiomodulation has been practiced in clinics across the world for the last 60 years.

There are more than 7, 000 clinical research studies, articles, peer reviewed papers. There is zero chance of any, you know, side effects, anything. It's just light, just light. Yeah. And to keep it safer, we don't use lasers. We use LEDs. Okay. Yeah. Pretty much everywhere you have LEDs. So we use medical grade.

LEDs. It's a class A registered device.

Ryan:I'm just seeing you and I living 200, 000 years from now, where we're in a spaceship and it automatically just turns on the light. Mr. Kumar, Mr. Ryan, today your daily dose of, of in your infrared is being limited. Please stand at one location. We're going to radiate you.

Ha ha

Bargodia:ha ha ha! So now you don't need to stand at one location.

Ryan:Okay.

Bargodia:You can just plug in our device in your nostril. I want to try it out. Ha ha ha ha! You can actually plug it in. And like I said, it's available. You can walk with it, run with it, do what you want.

Ryan:I'm really excited to try out your device.

So, can I have it? Cheers. Okay, so how easy is it to use? I just have to plug it in, right?

Bargodia:It's, it's made in India, made for India. Okay. As long as you know how to charge your mobile phone, you know how to use the device. There is no mobile app. There are no buttons, no controls. That's it. Just plug it into your mobile phone.

It's on. And just, yeah, use it like a pair of tweezers. Just put it into your nostrils a little bit. That's it.

Ryan:Just a little bit. Not all the way up. Not all the way up. So some Indians have really long noses.

Bargodia:That's it. Absolutely. And how long does this go on for? 15 minutes is the minimum dosage. So it shuts off automatically after 15 minutes. So why at the nose level? So three reasons. One, the nose is a direct pathway through the brain. Right? So the light actually is going right up to the underside of your brain where it's getting absorbed by the mitochondria.

We mentioned the brain is dense in mitochondria. Correct. The second is, five out of your twelve arteries, major arteries, five out of them pass through your nose. So I'm irradiating, giving good energy to your arteries as well. And the third, that the skin and the tissues around your nostrils are very rich in capillaries, blood capillaries.

So, You're getting phenomenal benefits just by keeping it here.

Ryan:And 15

Bargodia:minutes once a

Ryan:day.

Bargodia:You can do twice a day as well, or just do twice one after the photo

Ryan:charge to my mitochondria. Fastest pathway to the brain who has 2 million. Any other way that I can do it besides this? So we also have a cap. So we have the cap?

Yes. Hey guys, can I get the cap? So this is really cool. And then the cap is your other device. Yes. And this has got all the LEDs in there. Right. So all I do is gotta wear it for how long? Up to

Bargodia:30 minutes.

Ryan:And, and, and of course there's a wire. Can you show my hair? No, nothing of the hair is blocking my scalp.

Bargodia:Yeah, the, the hair does blocks a lot of the light. But guess what? It actually helps your hair as well. So the red and near infrared light helps your hair. So, very little amount of the light actually penetrates your skull. Right. And reaches the brain, but that's fine, which is why compared to the nasal device, we've got so many LEDs in the cap so that some amount of light finally makes it through to the brain.

Ryan:And how long should

Bargodia:I wear

Ryan:the cap?

Bargodia:Up to 30 minutes. So

Ryan:this

Bargodia:cap,

Ryan:can I run with it? I'd need to have a power bank on, right? Yes. Yes.

Bargodia:Okay. So, you know, there's a wire and a remote control with it, a wired remote, which you plug into. Any power source, anything with a USB. So a power bank, your laptop, your iPad, you could run with it.

Do whatever you'd like with it. Awesome.

Ryan:And. Male brains and female brains different because I know my wife's gonna want to wear this immediately because you just said hair and I know that there's research on phototherapy, improving hair follicle growth. Sure. I'm looking at more for brain power. So there's going to be a fight at home for hair versus brain.

So our male brains and females different brains different.

Bargodia:Absolutely. So because of certain hormonal functions in the female body, For example, menstruation there is evidence that menstruation physically alters brain function. So, that's just one of the examples. But human brains, when looking at male and female, are wired differently, for sure.

Ryan:Definitely wired differently. Yes. Okay. So. Ultimately, if you got a brain mapping without knowing the gender and looking at two brain maps, could you, with wisdom and experience, know the difference between a male and female brain pattern?

Bargodia:I would rather not do that, because you know, when we do our brain mapping, there are only just three pieces of data we need from you.

One is your exact date of birth, because All of our data is codified according to age, right? So the brain of a 14 60 year old is going to be different. The second is whether you're left or right handed, because that makes a difference in your brain wave patterns. And the third is your gender at birth.

Okay. So your biological gender. Makes a difference in your brain wave patterns.

Ryan:Awesome. So, Kumar, in my clinic, without phototherapy or brain mapping, we've always used nutrition to get the brain to the next level. I always say this in my seminars, 60 percent of your brain is made up of fats, of which 50 percent is the omega 3, the healthy fats.

And we actually do a blood test, a pinprick blood test, where we actually find out a lot of us are deficient. Sure. In the right fats because you're taking too much of the seed oils of fried foods or junk foods. And so our inflammatory oils, which are the arachidonic, the palmitic are much higher in our blood.

And therefore I feel that has a significant neutral nutrition, biochemistry impact on the brain. So something as simple as a pinprick and something as Star Trek like to be put on the head in terms of just, you know, first reading the patterns and then enhancing the mitochondria that we have. So, for me Getting brain mapping, phototherapy, and then I have nutritional therapy.

All of them just coming together is Star Trek and absolute curiosity for me to try this out. So I'm going to be coming in to map my brain with you soon.

Bargodia:Let me just say this well, Star Trek is from the past, 98%

of your nervous system and its processes, not chemical.

Ryan:Okay, now I need to step back because I've always thought as a biochemist, biochemistry, chemistry, biology, what are they?

Bargodia:It's based on energy, bioelectricity.

Ryan:Bioelectricity, that's a new term we heard here today.

Bargodia:Your brain, your body, your nervous system.

Almost everything runs on bio electrical energy. You generate it with movement, and you consume it with your processes. Certain movements you consume and generate. No amount of chemistry alone will help the energy, and no amount of energy alone will sort out the chemistry. Because for the longest time, we've not had access to understanding energy and improving it, we have relegated ourselves to Chemistry,

but the nervous system, only 2 percent is chemistry. Everything else is energy. You have to go back to your Vedic wisdom. It was all about energy. You can stay alive for food without eating for what? 14 days, 20 days, even longer. What happened to your chemistry then? Honestly, what happens to your chemistry?

So you will improve a lot of your biomarkers. Because the energy in your body now is actually being used for healing for combating inflammation, for growth, even in your nervous system. So when we think about the individual as a whole, I wouldn't rank one versus the other. I would say the primary goal should be understanding energy patterns.

And I don't mean this in a hocus pocus way like you said. You know, I don't get. I don't understand hypnosis and aura and all of that stuff. When I'm saying energy, I mean actual energy in the body, produced by mitochondria, ATP, right? I'm meaning brainwave patterns. So if you are low on energy, your patterns will auri.

If your patterns are already auri, they will consume too much energy for the same task, right? If they're consuming too much energy, you will suddenly feel hungry for no reason. You're suddenly in a bad mood because your patterns are not correct. You will overeat. You will do stress based eating. So no amount of good food will help you that time.

No amount of bad food will harm you as much that time. Unless you sort out that 98%. Energy, energy, energy, bioelectricity.

silent:Sorry.

Ryan:On that note, full of energy. An amazing podcast with you, Kumar. I've picked your brains. You've given me energy. Truly. This has been one of my most electrifying podcasts. Thank you so much, Ryan.

Thank you so much.

Bargodia:It's been a pleasure.

Ryan:So this has been truly an electrifying episode and my brains are abuzz with information now if you want to reach out to mr Kumar, there's a link in the description below Or if you want to get the omega 3 blood test done at the comfort of your home Just click the link below in the description and we'll get that kit across to you where you can do the blood test at Home now if you want this sexy looking purple cap or the nose LEDs that I put into my nose earlier on in the episode I'm bringing it to you with a special Ryan Fernando discount available here on my podcast.

So all you have to do is click on that link and get buying and let's get electrified. And if you've liked my podcast and watch this far, A subscribe only helps me find great people like Mr. Kumar and brilliant products like theirs. And if you want me to get more of them, I need you to subscribe and help me spread the message on how we can go into the future with super powered brains.

Thank you for watching this far. It's been an amazing episode and I'm so grateful to have you till the end. If you like this video, please share this video with your loved ones. Better still, gift me a subscribe. a like, or even a comment and we'll come back to you.

Key Quotes

• "Your subconscious is 300,000 times more powerful than your conscious mind."

  • Kumaar on the importance of leveraging subconscious patterns for success.

• "Mitochondria are the powerhouses of brain function—boosting them transforms how you think and feel."

  • On the critical role of energy in brain health.

Mentioned Tools and Techniques

• Brain Mapping: A non-invasive tool for analyzing cognitive patterns.

• Near-Infrared Light Therapy: Enhances mitochondrial energy for better brain function.

• Reward-Based Brain Training: Reinforces optimal brainwave patterns for focus and emotional regulation.

Resources

• NeuroLeap: Kumaar’s organization offering brain mapping and training solutions.

• Recommended tools for mitochondrial health and cognitive performance.

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